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All comments by Imtiaz Husain
1 2 3
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Thanks for all the suggestions. I guess I need to try out some of these programs and get a better appreciation of their capabilities.

Michael - (wikipedia define 1-hot as only 1 1 and the rest (in your case 53 - so I guess you must mean 13-hot) this is kinda similar to chess and since 53 < 64 the same mechanism can apply.

I like the idea of AI vs AI to develop better bidding systems.
But until I can see some results (yields) from such an approach,
I am likely to be skeptical.

As far as explain-ability is concerned my understanding is that
this is not really an issue. Its automated explain-ability (i.e)
can the computer explain itself that is the ongoing area of research. And yes in machine learning this can be tricky.

Jeannie - I can understand Monte Carlo tree search being useful
in programs like AlphaGo.

How big is the tree space in bridge? I can't imagine it as big
I guess it is complicated by the fact that you are trying to figure out what cards players hold. (That's where Monte Carlo comes in?)
June 16
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Oh man - I would love to get a copy of the data to do my own analysis. Chess databases have features like find innovations etc.

It would be amazing to do similar types of analysis on BBO data.
Who can I talk to see if I can get a copy of that data?
June 14
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I don't consider double dummy solvers real AI. They just use a simple mathematical algorithm. If they do use alpha-beta it is really play all 13 cards evaluate the result - compare.
That is not really alpha-beta min max, as there is no tree-pruning - which is a requirement for alpha-beta min-max.


OK thought about it some more - there must be tree pruning for complete fails - not sure if this still constitutes alpha-beta


Thanks for responding though. I am, however, more interested in how AI handles/solves the bridge problem. I appreciate your spending the effort to answer this question.

I am assuming the correct solution should not involve alpha-beta min max. But if I were to write a program - I cannot imagine a different type of solution.
June 14
Imtiaz Husain edited this comment June 14
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Yes if you hard code bid game at 26 combined hcp then there are a number of hands your evaluation functions will do poorly on. This is the same problem in games like chess. However, just like in chess better evaluation functions produce better results. (faster + more accurate)

I would think that in bridge you can have more complicated evaluation function, as you are not dealing with as large a tree as in chess or go.

You should in theory be able to create better evaluation functions
than experts - so I disagree with your example.
June 14
Imtiaz Husain edited this comment June 14
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What algorithms apply to bridge playing programs? I assume some sort of alpha-beta min max is a non-starter?
June 13
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I think the title of this article says it all
June 13
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Yes - I enjoyed this hand very much - Thank you Kevin for sharing!
June 12
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Dave,

Just for my records, is this
i) a hypothetical
ii) an statement of intention
or
iii) a statement of what you are doing at the moment.


BTW are you playing online while doing so?


Just need all the facts before we can reply to your comments
June 6
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Also you could try BBO (Bridge Base online). They have a number of online lessons.
The website I strongly recommend is Bridgeclue2.com for daily problem type hands/lessons on both bidding and play.
A couple years of just that and you can quickly get to lifemaster strength.


Most clubs have a partnership desk that can pair you up with a player and some of the larger clubs have beginners play sessions, you might pick up a partner that way too.

I would also check out learnbridge.nyc https://www.learnbridge.nyc/learn.html

https://www.learnbridge.nyc/two-over-one.html

https://coursehorse.com/nyc/classes/life-skills/games/bridge/beginning-bridge2


http://www.honorsbridgeclub.org/beginners.html Jeff Bayone (917) 544-1224 honorsbridge@gmail.com
May 27
Imtiaz Husain edited this comment May 27
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I don't see that.
Either 3 is game forcing or not. It is up to responder to decide based on the answers he/she receives. Responder has chosen to forgo bidding 2N and shown a 2 suiter instead.

1) He/she wants to know which suit is preferred
2) How good is the fit
3) passed hand: If 3 is not game-forcing - is opener in the
upper or lower end of the range.
unpassed hand: what are the prospects for slam - unassigned
bids should be interpreted as cue bids.


Let's look at the biding options:


Note: (p)-p-(p)-1N-(p)-2-(p)-2-(p)-3/4/4
show :6+ and are auto-splinters, so we will ignore those.

———————————————————-

(p)-p-(p)-1N-(p)-2-(p)-2-(p)-3-(p)-?
Note: responder must be invitational or better

Accept Game invitation in Hearts
——————————–
What bid shows a good heart fit and max
-> the super accept after (p)-p-(p)-1N-(p)-2-(p)-?
There are a number of other bids here that fall under
your super-accept structure that could show 3
and some ruffing shortness or some other feature.
They may or may not apply in passed hand settings.


What bid shows a good heart fit :4
(p)-p-(p)-1N-(p)-2-(p)-2-(p)-3-(p)-3
(no point cuebidding here)

[I really don't see the value of showing the converse -
genuine spade suit :4 no stoppers
no and fit. Something like AKQx QJ xxxx Kxx
looking for 3N]

:4 :2 ???
(p)-p-(p)-1N-(p)-2-(p)-2-(p)-3-(p)-4
The problem with this bid is opener doesn't know
if a suit | that has no wasted values is also
responder's short suit. Rather opener needs to have
club shortness for this bid or a double fit.
Of course for some really good double fits, he
can simply bid 4 - conventional.

Accept Game invitation in Clubs
——————————–

good club fit - this should be gf in
but again passed hand bidding could change
the meaning of this bid as 5 is also available.
(p)-p-(p)-1N-(p)-2-(p)-2-(p)-3-(p)-4
If partner void or singleton he can still show it.
->bypass 3N

unusual club fit - sign-off in clubs?
(p)-p-(p)-1N-(p)-2-(p)-2-(p)-3-(p)-5
->bypass 3N/4H and any slam exploration


Accept Game invitation in NoTrump
———————————


(p)-p-(p)-1N-(p)-2-(p)-2-(p)-3-(p)-3N

Waiting bids:
————–
We have 2 bids

What bid shows some sort of (poor heart fit/poor hand)
(p)-p-(p)-1N-(p)-2-(p)-2-(p)-3-(p)-3
willing to be passed out in 3 or raised to 4
These should show :3


generic waiting bid
(p)-p-(p)-1N-(p)-2-(p)-2-(p)-3-(p)-3


******************************************************
[I really don't see the value of showing a diamond suit
here :5 no stoppers and no and fit. Something
like xxx QJ AKxxx KQx looking for 3N
I definitely would want to know if partner has :5+
though I would prefer him ruffing with his hand]
This hand is no unlikely using 3 as a catch-all is better,
and consistent the unpassed hand approach.

The unpassed hand 3 would have been a cue-bid.
******************************************************

So from an invitational hand perspective
we have only one catch-all bid:

(p)-p-(p)-1N-(p)-2-(p)-2-(p)-3-(p)-3
While 3 sounds like it shows it should be a waiting
bit. Just as 3 sounds like it shows - It should
set trumps and force game opposite an invitational hand.
May 27
Imtiaz Husain edited this comment May 27
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OK I got that wrong:

(p)-p-(p)-1N-(p)-2-(p)-2-(p)-3-(p)-3 is not Goldman.
(p)-p-(p)-1N-(p)-2-(p)-2-(p)-2N-(p)-3 is Goldman.

Does the same principle apply?
May 27
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Regarding the (p)-p-(p)-1N-(p)-2-(p)-2-(p)-3 treatment:
Is this the classic or modern school treatment?
(I need to update my system notes :) and not sure which set to update.)

So, if partner was not a passed hand, he is not supposed to bid
3 with something like xx Axxxx xx KQxx? The correct bid would have been 2N?

Also, if 3 is passable then I assume 3 (Goldman?), 3N, 4 are the primary game going bids?
(p)-p-(p)-1N-(p)-2-(p)-2-(p)-3-(p)-3 sets as trump
(p)-p-(p)-1N-(p)-2-(p)-2-(p)-3-(p)-4 sets as trump

Would 3 by responder over 3 have been game forcing - I don't think so since responder has 3 (must be artificial game force)
(p)-p-(p)-1N-(p)-2-(p)-2-(p)-3-(p)-3-(p)-?

3 invitational with good hearts eg: xx AKxxx xx Qxxx
3 game-forcing with good hearts eg: xx AKxxx xx Kxxx

I am also assuming the sequence
(p)-p-(p)-1N-(p)-2-(p)-2-(p)-4 is an auto-splinter.

Please feel free to chime in?
May 27
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May 26
Imtiaz Husain edited this comment May 26
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I think most people had one or more of the following reasons for taking the course:
1) It was a Meatgrinder university - if you didn't want to take this course you could choose a major instead.
2) Mandatory course for particular program type (specialist vs major)
3) Arrogance (The students had a more accurate name for our course - “Defective and deficient Computing”). The entire course was about mathematically mapping programs into code for Turing machines in order to prove whether they were np or np complete. The course “separated the boys from the men.”
4) A desire to contribute to the state of current scientific endeavors but understanding our frontiers.

I guess this is going to Segway into my bridge dream - so I will start another discussion below.
May 25
Imtiaz Husain edited this comment May 25
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Barry, I've done that too - maybe not with bridge problems though. Only in the morning I tend to discover the reasoning
is completely over my head, and my notes aren't detailed enough
to even begin understanding.

“Hogamus Higamus …”
May 24
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Damn! Amy that was you? Now am I really going to have nightmares playing in the same tournament.

My friend used a really classic maneuver with the professor who was having some trouble recognizing him. Naturally, he started tactfully by complimenting him on the last lecture of class.
After all, what else are smarts good for? “I am missing a few lecture notes, and I was wondering if I could photocopy yours?”
He started. “Which ones?” the Professor queried, still trying to place him.

“All of them!” he replied as the astonished professor handed him
the course notes to a course known for its 80% failure rate.

The morale I learnt from him was how important it was to attend the lecture before the next exam. Now, John you and everyone here
know the secret to avoiding those classic anxiety dreams - ask for lecture notes!
May 24
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Yeah we don't read all that well when dreaming :)
May 23
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I would recommend recording some vugraph voice commentaries and playing them back while you sleep. Might as well be productive when you dream!!!


Or even take some complicated bidding material like
Kryzstof Martens books put them through some sort of
audible reader and play them while sleeping.


Your dreaming is telling you your brain doesn't want you to
waste your valuable time
May 22
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How about dreaming of finding an amazing way to play a suit combination only to realize when you wake up - it was just a dream. Nah! Sounds too hokey.
May 22
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I kinda like 3 Keeps the options open. No sense committing to game in 5. If partner has AQx I find the Moysian fit.
May 22
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